INTRO
True, we've never before had a nearly-instantaneous, nearly-worldwide network connected to devices in our pockets alerting us to rising temperatures and the temperamental outbursts of tyrants or the spread of malicious insects and viruses.
And being constantly aware of all this can feel disorienting and surreal.
But even so, we're not convinced we should be so quick to call our times "totally unprecedented." Our ancestors weathered tyrants and plagues and renovated their political thought and activity when facing the consequences of previous human actions.
And for those of us within the Christian Tradition, we must always remember that our predecessors took on the challenge of reinterpreting all of reality in light of the singular life of Jesus of Nazareth.
What is not "unprecedented" is humans encountering the unprecedented. And in the midst of our own unique challenges, we unnecessarily feed the bad reactions that can come with fear and uncertainty if we believe we face our challenges alone.
So, in this series, we look at people and moments in the Tradition where those who came before us give us precedents for facing our epoch-shaping tests and tasks.
In this episode we discuss heroes, and which ones truly give us a precedent for understanding Christian greatness.
STORY
A surrounding culture always shapes how people understand and engage the ethical issues and intellectual questions of their day. And in the first two episodes of this series we laid out some of how early Christians, as they engaged their world, distinctly synthesized elements from both the Jewish and Hellenistic cultures surrounding them.
Now, there are always an incalculable number of ways one bit of culture can be synthesized into a different tradition - just spend half a minute scrolling through all the different musical sub-genres out there on Spotify. Notice how R&B and Hip-hop have been synthesized into both jazz and metal. Or how many vastly different artists can incorporate Latin rhythms.
And like a middle-eastern musical scale or a tribal groove making its way into a genre of music originating from a vastly different time and place, in the centuries surrounding Jesus of Nazareth, different bits of the Jewish and Roman cultures made their way into any number of other societies and philosophical schools and religious traditions.
But Christians incorporated elements of their world in the particular way they did, because other central pieces of their culture, like their worship and prayer and social customs, were shaping them into people who understood everything in light of one, distinct, conviction. That central conviction was that Jesus is simultaneously the fully transcendent God, and a fully human person totally engaged in and present to everything that any human is engaged in and present to.
And the gospel Christians confess, being birthed in this distinct womb, necessarily takes on a distinct character. Like Jesus was divine, his gospel includes the highest, most sacred and mysterious ideas -- like those chased by Plato. And like Jesus was human, his gospel takes on the character of common and routine events that take place in space and time. In this, the gospel radicalizes the tendency of the Jewish stories that came before to include laws about cooking meat and handling routine conflict with neighbors right alongside outstanding stories about mountains shaking and fire dropping from the sky. Christ's life, and so his gospel, takes place in history, but also heals and transcends history by reconciling it to the divine.
Now, in offering this kind of potential intellectual guidance, in this episode, we also want to admit that in confusing and scary times, we look not just for something that can help us conceptually hold together this world and some other, better world. We also look for heroes who bridge the gap between this world and our ideals.
We always love heroes, but especially in challenging times, seek out people who offer us something this-worldly, something concrete enough to grab, cling to, and emulate so we can receive the benefits of our ideals where we are - because that's where our uncertainty and trouble is. And precisely in this collusion of the transcendent and the every day, heroes can offer a way to somewhere new, somewhere more stable and less threatening.
But our age also sits in the middle of the seismic tremors set off by the fall of Bishops and Evangelical Superstars. We shiver in the long-shadows of monuments erected to tyrants that stand right alongside statues to genuine heroes.
So if we are going to name any heroes for our moment, we know, instinctually, that we need to look beyond figures who are able to embody an ideal and amass hordes of devoted followers. Just playing the role of living a life-that-is-larger-than-life cannot be sufficient criteria to name someone a hero.
A Christian hero needs ... something more ...
Otherwise our heroes might inspire a picture of what it means to attain knowledge of divine things and accumulate diving power here and now that would construct an idea of GREATNESS that looks a lot like some of the bloodiest empires or most ruthless tyrants of history.
So, moving forward in this episode, we acknowledge, and ask you to acknowledge, both that a gospel that moves through concrete events and takes us somewhere heavenly, sounds like real hope, but can also, and to many does, sound like the beginning of a bloody imperialism.
Yes heroes carry power, but for either heavenly good, or unimaginable evil.
So it's important that the earliest Christians set a vital precedent for us when they chose, as the highest honor that could be awarded any Christian hero, the title "Martyr."
One of the most beloved, and widely spread stories of the early Christian martyrs was that of a man named Polycarp. He became something of a Christian celebrity. So, as we tell his story, contrast it with what today tends to build someone a platform, and note what that contrast says about what ancient Christians found heroic and great.
Polycarp was born in 69 AD. This puts his life at a crucial juncture for the Church, when first apostles were dying off.
Polycarp was a disciple of one of those first apostles, named John. And what John passed on to Polycarp effected more than just how Polycarp thought about the relationship between the divine and the human. It shaped who he was. As one of Polycarp's laters disciples, Irenaeus, put it, "I could tell you the place where the blessed Polycarp sat to preach the Word of God. It is yet present to my mind with what gravity he everywhere came in and went out; what was the sanctity of his deportment, the majesty of his countenance; and what were his holy exhortations to the people. I seem to hear him now relate how he conversed with John and many others who had seen Jesus Christ, the words he had heard from their mouths."
Polycarp eventually became the Bishop of Smyrna, a city on the Western coast of what is now Turkey. Much of his ministry was characterized by the way he converted people to Christ from a form of faith that sought to totally escape the realities and troubles of this world.
And finally, Polycarp did not just convert them to a faith that inhabits this troubled world, but he modeled for them how to enter that trouble as Christ would.
Though Polycarp was born into the faith, the authorities waited until very late in his life to put his faith to the ultimate test.
When word got out the the Roman authorities were seeking to arrest Polycarp, he initially decided to wait patiently for them at his home. But then some followers came to him and he noticed their panic, for their sake he agreed to move to a small place outside the city.
But while sleeping there, Polycarp had a vision of his pillow turning to fire. When he woke up, he laconically told his companions, "I must be burned alive."
When one of Polycarp's friends betrayed his location to the Romans and the soldiers came for him, some of his friends again tried to get him to flee. Instead, Polycarp opened the door for the soldiers and prepared them a meal. As they ate with him, Polycarp prayed.
After a couple hours, they placed Polycarp on a donkey and took him to the proconsul who interrogated Polycarp in front of a crowd. In the back and forth discussion of his trial, Polycarp showed a surprising amount of poise and wit for someone whose life was at stake. And when the Proconsul lost his cool and threatened Polycarp with terrible tortures unless he reviled Christ, Polycarp said, "Eighty and six years have I served Him, and He never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?"
Polycarp was sentenced to burn at the stake. He was taken to the arena but when the soldiers went to nail him in place, Polycarp told them, "Leave me as I am; for He that gives me strength to endure the fire will also enable me to remain without moving in the pile. No need for the security you seek with your nails."
The fire was lit, but instead of consuming him, shaped itself like an arch or the sail of a ship when filled by the wind, and encompassed Polycarp. And instead of taking on the quality of burnt flesh, as the story was told by early Christians, the body of the martyr became like bread that is baked.
When the soldiers perceived that Polycarp's body could not be consumed by the fire, they commanded an executioner to enter the flames and pierce Polycarp with a dagger in the side. When the executioner obeyed, a dove and great quantity of blood poured forth from Polycarp's open wound, so that the fires were extinguished.
And as the early Christians writers put it, intentionally shaping the way their hero's story would be told, Polycarp's martyrdom was, quote, "altogether consistent with the gospel of Christ."
Our gospel should shape our heroes.
But it is also true that the heroes we choose will shape the way we understand our gospel. And so, in the conversation that follows, Julius and I talk about what really constitutes Christian Greatness, and how we can recognize the kinds of people that help us understand and live the gospel well in difficult times.
DISCUSSION
Julius: Welcome back to “All Things”— as always if this is your first time listening, this is Julius and Wil. And for all of you who…
Wilson: Not always… Typically, but there are also, there, there are many episodes with others with guests.
Julius: Exactly. But, by default Wil and I are pretty much always around.
Wilson: We're the floor that you fall to… and hopefully the floor is not that bad.
Julius: So, to launch into today's conversation and kind of reflecting on the story that came before this— honestly, while prepping for recording, I was, to check my mic, I was singing an an old Whitney Houston song… and the line that stuck out to me from that one—it was a song that my dad always called me to sing with him on stage as a kid—but it was…there’s a lyric that says, “Everybody’s searching for a hero, people need someone to look up to…”
And that might seem like a really cheesy connection here, but I've got to admit that that was kind of what was in my head this whole time after the story that we just came from—
Wilson: Well, okay, here, here. I'm going to, can I…this is slightly tangential, but I'll make a big case for it.
Julius: Oh, please.
Wilson: With the slickness, the marketing, and every… all the production that goes into Whitney Houston, a line like that doesn't make it into a pop song that they know someone with this many fans is going to is going to listen to if they don’t, if they don't trust that that speaks to something pretty broad and deep that's going on in the culture. So…
Julius: That’s pretty good.
Wilson: I liked that, that was right off the— that was on the fly,
Julius: Nice.
Wilson: I think, it's good cause it's true.
Julius: I think so too. But I think today, I mean, this series, we're talking about finding precedents, especially in the Christian tradition that help us kind of navigate—I mean, you all know, we've thrown around the phrase "unprecedented and challenging times,” but we're trying to look to these stories to give us some kind of hope to say, “Sure, there, are certain things that might not be as they ever were. But that doesn't mean that we don't have guidance from the people that came before us to things that are similar.”
And so this whole series kind of touches on the question of why the people that we look up to and heroes matter because as a people we're always looking to stories and people who can embody a way forward for us… or who can, who have um… a kind of life and character that we're able to emulate to help us navigate challenging times.
So of course, today, we want to look first at the foundation of the Christian faith, which would be the life and character of Jesus, first of all, as our hero in the faith. So I want to ask the question—
Wilson: There would be no Polycarp, if, if Polycarp hadn't taken Jesus as his hero.
Julius: Right. Yeah. exactly. So so starting with that, right? Like as, as we, as Christians are looking for examples, of course the life of Jesus is like the foundation of our gospel hope and the character of Jesus too. And character is not something that is, like, abstract, but is something that we determine from spending time with someone and seeing how they live and how they deal with circumstances.
So what are some stories in the gospels that show us Jesus’s character— who he was and how he dealt with things that like we humans face, being someone who is fully human and fully divine?
Wilson: We could go to Mark chapter 8, where, with a little bit of backstory to set up this episode, it's good to know that… the, the Jewish people who were looking for a Messiah at this time and this place—and probably also good to know as, just a slightly tangential point, that not all Jewish people were hoping in and looking for a Messiah. They were in, they were in very, very trying times themselves, and having been under the boot of empire after empire… you know Assyria and Babylon and Greece and Rome over and over and over again…
And now currently finding themselves kind of crushed and overrun by Rome, there were a lot that had given up on that kind of hope and we're finding other ways to make a life and to, to try to live their days and whatever kind of relative peace that they could.
But those who were looking for a Messiah because of that backstory that we just quickly ran through, were looking for a militaristic hero. Right. Now they had lots of precedents for a prophet. They had lots of precedents for great teachers. But they had kind of a vaguely defined hope for a messiah. Right. But it would, to them, it would be probably if there was a precedent for them, it would be something like David— a mighty warrior who was also filled with the spirit of God. And so the Messiah is going to be a militaristic hero that's going to run our enemies out and give us our land back.
And so in Mark 8, Jesus at this point, you've got eight chapters, and in the Gospel of Mark, that's a lot because it's the, it's the shortest of the gospels. That's half— it's fully half of the, of the Gospel of Mark. And so halfway through the story, Jesus has done a lot of incredible things, and at this point in chapter eight is when Jesus turns to his disciples and say, “Who do the people say that I am?”
And they say that others say, “Well, some are convinced that you're a great teacher.” Because Jesus had done what great teachers do— looking for precedents, that’s what Jesus had done. He'd opened up the scripture. He'd applied it in ways that were faithful to the Jewish heritage in history, but, but in a, in a creative and innovative way that opens stuff up now.
So faithful and you, you know, so you're a great teacher because that's what great teachers do. Others say, you're a mighty prophet because Jesus had done what prophets do. Now here's a point where, for contemporary minds who—and this isn't just, who are just a little bit or open to, or questioning the Christian faith— even to a lot of Christian minds that have spent a lot of time in church or reading the scriptures, we can conflate the prophetic role and the messianic role as far as what they understood back then.
Because prophets raised the dead. Prophets, worked miracles. Prophets did incredible things. I mean think Moses, he parts the sea. Right. And, and there are stories of like a widow's son dying and a prophet breathes on them and brings, brings the dead back to life. Right. There's precedent. I mean, it's, it's miraculous, but there's precedent for it in the Jewish imagination. And that's what prophets do. Jesus had done incredible things.
Now for us today, we might think, “Oh, he raised the dead. He did this. He walked on the water. That's messianic.” No, no, no, no, no. Not to their— that wasn't the job description or the role… that wasn't the precedent, to stick with our current metaphor scheme. Back then—or the metaphor we're building from the word, the concept precedent to them, that's prophetic.
And so people said, “Hey, we've seen you, you've done miracles, we've seen it. Or we've heard that you've done it. And we believe what we've heard. And so you're a prophet.” And the ca- the level, the kind of miracles you've pulled off, you're a mighty prophet up there with Moses and Elijah. So there were lots of people that would already put Jesus, like high on the list of the heroes. Like the, the greatest, the exemplars of greatness. Right? So you're that. And Jesus says, “But who do you say that I am?”
Julius: Hmm.
Wilson: And Peter the first human— notice, none of the people in that time, in that place say Messiah. Even with, even those who saw him and benefited from that kind of miracle, none of them say that. Peter’s the first human to say Messiah. And Jesus’s response is “Blessed are you Peter, because you didn't come to that conclusion on your own. You could only see that if my heavenly father helped you to see that.”
Julius: Wow. Yeah.
Wilson: Because at that moment, Jesus had done nothing messianic. I mean, he hadn't, he hadn't done anything militaristic. He hadn't picked any fights with any Roman soldiers. Let alone win any of those fights. The only thing he's done is, finally in the Gospel of Mark he decided to go to Jerusalem, which would be the place where the Jewish powers and the Roman powers are most intertwined. And so if someone were to go somewhere to pick a fight with the heart of Roman power in our place to win our land back, Jerusalem would be the place to do it.
And all—Jesus is not going with swords. He's not going with soldiers. All he's done is point himself in that direction. And from that alone, Peter says, “I do believe that you're the Messiah.”
Julius: Well, that's, that's so interesting, first of all, just cause I mean… of all people to get it Peter strikes me as the most kind of like a… warlike? Like, Peter's that… “Okay. Maybe don't cut off the person's ear.” Like the, quick to draw his sword, kind of like, um… but for him to kind of catch that, I feel like says something of like recognizing, um… something in Jesus's character.
And what I can't help, but think of how pertinent this whole, like, dynamic of the expectation of a Messiah being kind of like a war— a militaristic deliverer from powers of oppression— how how timely that is for our day, and kind of where we sit culturally and politically and in like…a lot of the people that I kind of talk to are, maybe more identify in kind of more progressive circles. And that comes from this place of feeling a lot of— like, dissatisfaction isn't even the right word— but just like really resistance to these like power structures that exist that perpetuate oppression to marginalized groups of people. And I see…
I see that like the people who want change are trending more and more towards kind of like this spirit of “What we can’t…No. Voting is not enough anymore. We can't trust like the system. We can't trust politics. Like, we need something more than that, like we need…
And so there's a spirit of militarism even in kind of just like a level of pushing towards like, “No, we have to build our own systems. We have to build our, the community has to take care of themselves." And then like the further left that, like I see people going, the more that, like, I see a propensity towards like, "No, we have to like, it's revolution's the answer.”
And so the heroes of the people who are dissatisfied with, like, these systems, like are more and more looking to something like what I imagined, like these people who were hoping for a Messiah to be. Something a little bit more like like, "We need a revolution.” Like this, like the status quo, isn't going to topple over if we play by these rules. So we have to be a little bit more like…we need a little bit more fight in us.
Wilson: Yeah.
Julius: And then for Jesus to come and be that Messiah and to kind of turn that expectation around, I think has so much to offer us. Now when we're at this point where like, I ha, like, I know people who. And I wrote like the French revolution and guillotines are like the heroes and the symbols of hope for people…
Wilson: Hm.
Julius: For like, for change, you know?
And, um. And I think that Jesus offering us a picture of kind of martyrdom that's like non… that's that is able to bring hope and change things, yet is not like the full militaristic “we have to like come with swords to destroy this thing.
Wilson: And there's to a certain point there's a lot there that I think is right. You know, that, that it's true, that you can't just trust the systems and the powers of the world to take care of the wrongs of the world. You can't look to a human figures or, or alone or to human systems alone.
And so there are certain cases where, I mean, I think, I think backing up in the story, it's been a tragedy for awhile that Christians have thought voting a certain way is the extent of our Christian duty to engage the world. And the temptation though is to eventually get so frustrated that you just switch for another human…
Julius: Right.
Wilson: …figure, or another human system. And that's where, you know, it's, it's odd on when you get to the extremes of left and right, you see more and more pronounced the differences and how how vitriolic that can get… angry it can get on both on both ends. But there's also some things that on both sides, they hold in common. And so eventually when you, when you push it to the extremes, I don't know. The last 10 years I've thought a lot about Pac-Man because of…
Julius: Oh, yeah,
Wilson: On the side, on the side of Pac-Man, when you're getting chased by the ghosts, if you go all the way to the right side of the screen, you just pop up on the left
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: And it's like, "Woah, how'd we end up here?” But there's, there's something there that you don't see, but that actually really, really ties the far right and the far left together, like the edges of the Pac-Man screen
Julius: That's so interesting.
Wilson: And, and where that ends up with is eventually people just get so angry, frustrated, hurt that they end up settling… for a human re- a merely human response to the evils of the world.
And you see this playing out in the story, right? So as this goes along with how this plays out with, with, uh… with Peter and Jesus in the book of Mark— which is why I said it's important that to notice the character of Jesus, but also the example and the precedent given for being a follower of Jesus from the first disciples. That we really should ask these questions because…
I mean, it, it, the guys, this stuff is… I mean, real pain, real suffering… and it does matter for generations. And it does matter for the innocent. These are massive, massive issues and questions. And, and we do want to be very, very careful that we don't offer something like martyrdom— w-we need to be very aware of what we're saying when we, when we say Christians hold up martyrs as a precedent.
Because we do not want to offer that in a way that will simply make any opposition to evil lie down. Right. And, and allow evil to continue to just trod through the earth and decimate and, and win and control everything. So it's important that we see that there's a tension and there's a back and forth here.
Yes, Jesus is our model, but we also need to see that it's good news. Part of the good news is Jesus has our model invites us to follow him and to also let the disciples’ path be ours too. Because Jesus Peter questions this, right. And here, here's how it plays out when I say, when I say Peter questions it. This is what I mean.
Julius: Okay.
Wilson: So it goes up to a certain point and Peter suddenly, I mean, Peter, over and over and over again, says the wrong things. And gets— and here's one where Jesus is like, “Hey, you said the right thing!” Like, “So right, Peter, that only God could have said that, basically through your mouth.” Like, “You didn't do that on your own. You're right. I am the Messiah.”
And now though, here, this is where some Bibles it's, it's kinda like—I get it. It helps for reference, but it can really throw the flow of the story, and it's super important that we read what Jesus just said. “You're right. Yes. I'm the Messiah. God revealed that to you.” And then what comes right after? Because often we get some, some bold texts that had like, “Here's a new little section…” heading that splits up the word.
But the way it's written and delivered, Jesus says, “Yes, you're right. I'm the Messiah. But here you need to know I am going to Jerusalem, but not for what you think I'm going for. I'm going there, and actually you think” right the one hint you had, okay. Jerusalem. That's where Rome is concentrated. If we're going to start a route, we were going to go there and have it out. You think that, but no, no, no.
It's going to be in a lot of ways. It's going to look, look exactly opposite of what you expect. I'm not going to go and kick out the Gentiles. In fact, my own people are going to hand me over to the Gentiles and they're going to.
Julius: yeah,
Wilson: up. Yes, I am the Messiah, but not the way you expect, they're going to kill me.
I'm not going to kill them. And then notice the very next thing Peter says is he rebukes Jesus. That's a strong.
Julius: Right.
Wilson: that's a strong thing to do to your rabbi, especially if you're convinced that your rabbi is, you know, at least one of the mighty profits up there with Moses and Elijah, if not God incarnate, you know, and this is part of the story is like exactly when the human followers of Jesus come to a realization of.
You know, but it does me any of those, that's it, it doesn't matter where exactly Peter was in that moment of his awareness of Jesus's divinity. That's a bold thing to do. Now we're back to the old Peter that says the wrong things. He's rebuking Jesus and Jesus rebuked him right back, even stronger. Jesus says, get behind me Satan, because, and here's, here's our point where we're drawn out what we've got to chase, but we've got to do it with humility.
Openness, all. We've got to, we've got to know. Yes, we're chasing divine things, but the only way do we do this, if is if the divine is holding our hand, leading us there,
because Jesus says you do not have in mind the things of God, but the things of humanity.
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: Yes, you're right. There's a serious problems. Something has to be taken on here. Something has to be done about it,
Julius: yeah, yeah,
Wilson: you think it's going to be done is just going to further contribute to the problem. It's going to keep perpetuating the same human violence and hatred, the same human division.
That's going to keep you turning on each other. You're just going to, you're going to change the categories. You're going to change the groups, but the same old violence is going to keep happening. And so, yes, I'm the Messiah, but no, I'm not going to do it the way you expect me to do it.
Julius: Hm. So we're at this, at this point in this story, right? That you were talking about where Jesus is talking to Peter, we start to see Jesus talk about an alternative to, Hey, I'm going to Jerusalem. I am the Messiah, but I'm not going to Jerusalem to do what you think I'm doing. Okay. So what does this pattern, right?
That we've named as martyrdom as kind of the shape of like what a Crow like Christian greatness looks like, what does martyrdom do and how, how does it.
actually affect a way forward in a way that heals rather than just being a Fe like a symbolic thing, but that is really like a passive accepting of defeat from the systems that be and continue to like serve violence among.
Wilson: I think the best way to do that is, is to start with. Concrete words and, and episodes from the gospels and, and kind of inductively draw some conclusions from that. And one of the things Jesus explicitly says his death will do is judge the world. That's one of my favorite things is, is the way Jesus talks about judgment in the gospel of John.
So we've switched here from, from mark.
Julius: Yeah,
Wilson: But it kind of throws a wrench in some of our thinking. And definitely me, you know, when, especially with, with some of my story that we don't have. All the way into, but I definitely went through a period where I decided to, I don't want to be a judgmental Christian.
That was an explicit thing in my head. Right. And that created a certain kind of momentum. And there was, there was positive growth in, in the awareness of judgmentalism, how it had taken root in my mind and my heart. Right. And positive to want to do something about that. But similar to Peter, you know, he's like, Messiah.
That's what we need. Here's how we're going to do it. And she's like, you're right. That's what we need, but you're wrong about how to do it. So you're right. We'll you don't want to be judgmental, but then what Jesus says in John kind of is that wrench going, but not that way, because Jesus straight up says I came into the world to judge the world.
Right. And then when you start thinking, well, what is judgment? What is it really? Oh, we do want that. We all want. You know, if judgment comes in the middle of overwhelming, terrifying, scary, confusing times and says here's, here's the truth. Here. Here's how you judge in the middle of all of this. Here's how you discern what's right.
And good. And what's wrong. We all need that. And, and now we've seen this more and more as we, as we get more honest about what wrongs and sins do to the victims, we become aware we do want judgment, right. And so it's not that we don't want judgment. We don't want bad.
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: want good judgment. We want true and just judgment.
Right? And so it's good news that Jesus says I came into the world to judge the world because if anyone's qualified, you know, if we're going to give that heavy responsibility to anyone, I vote Jesus. So it's good news that he says, I'm willing to take that on for you. Right. I came into the world to judge the world.
It's also good news. And here's where it really dovetails with. What was going on in mark chapter eight with Peter, but it's not going to happen. Like you think,
Julius: right, right, right, right?
Wilson: right? How does Jesus judge the world? And this is where a whole lot of themes that we tend to think of. We separate and we categorize really, really harmonizing and integrate.
And Jesus' judgment. Jesus says happens at the cross. That's how I judge the world is I lay down my life. Because if judgment comes right in the middle, I mean, and if you want to talk about the middle of violence and hate and confusion and darkness and death in the middle of the worst, if judgment, if we need judgment in the middle of the worst, you can't think of a situation that's more in the middle of the worst than the cross life, the source of life and goodness itself being murdered right there.
That's where judgment comes. And how does he judge the world by laying down his life?
Julius: Right.
Wilson: Bye bye. And publicly that's another thing, right? Roman executions, where public kinda like French revolution. Why did they do it in public? They wanted everyone to see.
Julius: Totally.
Wilson: Right. And Roman executions, it's not like in the American prison system where we hide it away in some backroom behind barbed wire and concrete walls, where only a few select group of people can see that it actually took place.
We, they didn't hide it. They did it in public and Jesus submitted to that public. Why? So everyone can see what does that do? That shows. That that puts on display God's judgment
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: and what it shows us, what it judges and just makes clear as day is our rebellion and our death, our, our intent to carry things out in a way that it backfires and strikes it life.
It's.
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: And, and think about all the sides everyone's implicated in the cross. There's no one side that gets all the blame, which is, I think that's a word that we need for today. That's a precedent that we need for today is if, whenever we start to believe. That we've got some righteous cause, well, there's probably some kernel of truth and goodness in that.
Right. But when we, when it gets to the point where we're so convinced we're so right, that we would be justified and taking another person's life.
Well now, like all of that gets implicated and pulled together and to, and similar to what happens with Jesus, no one group or party is is totally free of Christ.
I mean, even his own disciples had roles to play in that happening to him. Right. And, and when Jesus submits that way, that is the judgment of the world that makes clear the truth of our condition and exposes our fallenness and exposes our propensity to, to think we're fixing things by doing something that's only going to perpetuate the post.
So judgment martyrdom carries out and displays judgment of the world. Set.
Julius: So to take that concretely on like what this precedent has to offer for us in navigating challenging times, and especially like we've touched on like what to do in resisting like systems and structures that continue to perpetuate like violence and injustice. So Jesus has Set.
the precedent that martyrdom is kind of the shape of what Christian greatness in these times looks like.
And like what the course of action, right. In, in dealing with violence and injustice and paving a way towards like reconciliation with God and hope and all that stuff. What then does it look like for us to follow in that precedent in such a way that doesn't just like, That doesn't just mean that we look for ways to die or like what I mean?
Wilson: Yeah, I think what's key. There is that we are crystal clear that it sets a precedent for our ideal in our. And we'll always need those. Right. But it doesn't set the precedent for the exact precise path everyone is called to. Right. So I think it becomes important here too, to value. If we say the character of the gospel is one that meets us in the midst of his.
You know, and so on that, that dimension of it, we have to, we have to take into account that in the scriptures. Yes. At that moment, at that time, when Jesus knew it's time, I'm going to drew slum and this is what's going to happen. But there were other times where Jesus got word of sun, some of his enemies, trying to throw him off a cliff or stone him.
And he alluded them. Right. So to be Christ, like doesn't mean, we always just hope somebody mad at me. All right. Do your thing. And here, right here, I am your doormat. That's not Christ-like, there's something deeper. It takes a greater discernment and more times than not. Jesus alluded them. And similar with his disciples.
You move from that to the gospel of acts. There are two people I can think of that were martyred Peter and Paul. Right? They, they were also martyred, but there were also more times than so, I mean, by definition, they were martyred once, right. That like, cause that's kind of the limit. Right.
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: And so, so numerically vastly more times they escaped
Julius: Yeah.
Wilson: with the help of the church.
Both of them were imprisoned and they escaped. of them were attacked by mobs and escaped the mobs. Both of them had stories where followers came and said, Hey, we got word of a mob or a group that's trying to do this. Let's sneak you out of town before they can get here. And they did. Right. So.
That leads into a kind of precedent where that, that begins to explain some of the complexity of the churches system and culture that they developed in the early centuries around this, where yes, they granted the title. Martyr as, as the highest title that could be granted, but they never said go seek it out.
In fact, too, like day in, day out to most people, they said don't and they came up with lots of ways to preserve life, to get people to escape. Right. And the stories of the martyrs, there's always a tension and a back and forth and a fight between the martyr and the people that are there in their corner.
Even with Polycarp, they're like, Hey, They're coming for you. We love you. You're our Bishop. Let's let, let's get you out of here. And he says no, and they say, no, let's get you out of here. And they, they don't just say, oh yeah, of course Martin. Well, that's what we do. We're doormats. They fight and there's a real back and forth and it's in the martyr and a genuine martyrdom.
It's it's you see something coming from deep inside the, the person and who, who freely choose it? The hardest scarier path that it's, that it's not just a, it's not a precedent in the sense of just some kind of road legalistic. Well, this is what you do, like it or not suck it up and die. Right. Because that doesn't actually change anything.
So the, the precedent, what it sets is, is an ideal for the hero and zooming out and looking larger. How many times do we see. Someone's martyrdom becoming the story that sets off genuine change. And I think historically, and there, there are plenty of. Top-notch historians who do not confess the Christian faith, they would still say the Christian martyrdom played a massive role in a lot of the changes and developments in, in culture.
And that we saw play out over the next couple of centuries from, from within Rome and that certain things that were just assumed in Roman culture, like. Well, if you're born a slave, you only have a portion of a human soul. Right? And so that's your proper place to the sorts of the, even the beginning of the idea of the equal dignity of every person begins when.
When Christians laid down, when some Christians laid down their life this way, other Christians took that, not as the way every single one of us is called to live, but that's our Christ like hero that shows us the truth. And that judges, that, that shows us the truth of the world in its sin, it judges it, and it shows us the truth of God's reality.
And if that, if, if our identity does come, not from our human structures, but from that divine reality, then this is the truth of who we are. And over time, It, it, it does revolutionize from the inside, but it does it in a way that, and I, and this is where I know it's, I know it's hard. But it does it in a way that that does not play the games of sin and death.
MEDITATION
If heroes integrate the actual and the ideal, then so much of what makes someone the kind of hero they will be is not just what happens, but how their story gets told.
So the early Christians who shaped the way the story of Polycarp would be told, went to great pains to make sure the ideals Polycarp integrated in the events of his life, were ideals birthed in the actual events of the life of Jesus.
Mark 8:31-32 And (Jesus) began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes and be killed, and after three days rise again. And he said this plainly.
According to The Martyrdom of Polycarp, "And while he was praying, a vision presented itself to him three days before he was taken; and, behold, the pillow under his head seemed to him on fire. Upon this, turning to those that were with him, he said to them prophetically, 'I must be burnt alive.'"
During the last dinner Jesus ate with his friends, he told them, "One of you will betray me." Then, Matthew 26:47-50 tells us, "While he was still speaking, Judas, one of the Twelve, arrived. With him was a large crowd armed with swords and clubs, sent from the chief priests and the elders of the people. Now the betrayer had arranged a signal with them: "The one I kiss is the man; arrest him." Going at once to Jesus, Judas said, "Greetings, Rabbi!" and kissed him. Jesus replied, "Do what you came for, friend." Then the men stepped forward, seized Jesus and arrested him.
After Polycarp retreated to the estate outside the city, his location was given up by one of the younger members of the home. So, as the ancient document puts it, quote, "It was thus impossible that (Polycarp) should stay hidden, since those that betrayed him were of his own household."
"And the scribes of the Pharisees, when they saw that he was eating with sinners and tax collectors, said to his disciples, 'Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?'" Mark 2:16
The Martyrdom of Polycarp, "when (Polycarp) heard that (the solderies who came to arrest him had arrived), he went down and spoke with them. And as those that were present marvelled at his age and constancy, some of them said. "Was so much effort made to capture such a venerable man?" Immediately then, in that very hour, (Polycarp) ordered that something to eat and drink should be set before (the soldiers), as much indeed as they cared for."
As Jesus entered Jerusalem, quote, "The disciples went and did as Jesus had directed them. They brought the donkey and the colt and put on them their cloaks, and he sat on them. " Matthew 21:6-7.
When the time had come to take Polycarp into the city, quote, "They set him upon an ass, and conducted him into the city."
Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him, "Are you the King of the Jews?" Jesus said, "You have said so." Matthew 27:11
And when the proconsul yet again pressed Polycarp, and said, "Swear by the fortune of Cæsar," he answered, "Since you are vainly urgent that, as you say, I should swear by the fortune of Cæsar, and pretend not to know who and what I am, hear me declare with boldness, I am a Christian."
But when they came to Jesus and found that he was already dead, they did not break his legs. Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus' side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water. John 19:33-34
At length, when those wicked men perceived that Polycarp's body could not be consumed by the fire, they commanded an executioner to go near and pierce him through with a dagger. And on his doing this, there came forth a dove, and a great quantity of blood, so that the fire was extinguished;
Earlier, we asked the questions, "What good does martyrdom do?" Jesus' crucifixion exposed the hell at work in our world, and robbed death of its power.
Polycarp's blood extinguished the fires around him.
So, may this kind of self-sacrificing Christlikeness become a working precedent for us. So we might recognize and celebrate heroes that help guide us through this time. So the inevitable sacrifices we make might look like Jesus', and so our lives might participate in Jesus' work to put out the fires of hell.